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 Post subject: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:40 pm 
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Sons of Thunder
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I really don't know what to do, the more and more I study about the liturgy, the more I pray about it, I'm more and more having an aversion to the New Mass. I'm almost ready to give up on it and throw in the towel.

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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:55 am 
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My 2 cents: The Church is under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. The Church has approved the Novus Ordo Mass. Therefore, both the NO and the TLM are approved for regular use. The problem, I think is the way some places present the NO. There is often an air of casualness or lack of reverence which can be disheartening. Sometimes it's the celebrant, sometimes the congregation. What to do? You can attend the TLM exclusively. You can complain loud and long to your priest(s), and you can be a good example of appropriate attire and behavior at the NO. You can complain to your bishop. You can give up. WWJD?
Just some thoughts.

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Linda

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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:09 am 
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Sons of Thunder
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PDUBYA wrote:
I really don't know what to do, the more and more I study about the liturgy, the more I pray about it, I'm more and more having an aversion to the New Mass. I'm almost ready to give up on it and throw in the towel.

I don't blame you. I have been to only three since the new translation, all of them in the last two weeks because I was substituting at a Catholic school.

That turned out to be a slight cosmetic change for me, really. You are going to have banal liturgy with no discipline behind it when you construct by a committee that is opposed to Catholic tradition, and often theology, and make drastic changes. Sadly the popes did not heed the majority of bishops, several of whom explicitly made a point of how any change erodes discipline and hence must be justified as greater than any harm.

The Church has approved it, yes, hence it isn't heretical or essentially deficient in itself. But it has been a disaster and directly contributes to its own abuse, because again any change weakens discipline. The problem is we had liberals change the liturgy who misunderstand human nature and therefore deny the role of tradition in enforcing discipline (heck Rome explicitly encouraged all sorts of experiments with the liturgy, explicitly encouraged creativity and all those abuses we now hate, such as a lay person walking up and taking communion from the ciborium himself, and other things that are shocking to read that Rome actually started before condemning).


You can do what I do when it becomes a distraction

1) do not look at other people, especially at communion time

2.) If you cannot pay attention with profit, quietly pray the rosary and unite your intentions to the Mass

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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:43 am 
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Sons of Thunder
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PDUBYA wrote:
I really don't know what to do, the more and more I study about the liturgy, the more I pray about it, I'm more and more having an aversion to the New Mass. I'm almost ready to give up on it and throw in the towel.


i reached that point 7 or 8 years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:36 pm 
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Paladin
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Solivagus in Mundi wrote:
PDUBYA wrote:
I really don't know what to do, the more and more I study about the liturgy, the more I pray about it, I'm more and more having an aversion to the New Mass. I'm almost ready to give up on it and throw in the towel.

I don't blame you. I have been to only three since the new translation, all of them in the last two weeks because I was substituting at a Catholic school.

That turned out to be a slight cosmetic change for me, really. You are going to have banal liturgy with no discipline behind it when you construct by a committee that is opposed to Catholic tradition, and often theology, and make drastic changes. Sadly the popes did not heed the majority of bishops, several of whom explicitly made a point of how any change erodes discipline and hence must be justified as greater than any harm.

The Church has approved it, yes, hence it isn't heretical or essentially deficient in itself. But it has been a disaster and directly contributes to its own abuse, because again any change weakens discipline. The problem is we had liberals change the liturgy who misunderstand human nature and therefore deny the role of tradition in enforcing discipline (heck Rome explicitly encouraged all sorts of experiments with the liturgy, explicitly encouraged creativity and all those abuses we now hate, such as a lay person walking up and taking communion from the ciborium himself, and other things that are shocking to read that Rome actually started before condemning).


You can do what I do when it becomes a distraction

1) do not look at other people, especially at communion time

2.) If you cannot pay attention with profit, quietly pray the rosary and unite your intentions to the Mass


When I am at a new Mass I bring a 1962 missal and start following some of the prayers with that missal, sometimes in Latin (all in my head as I never do responses or sing).
Lately I am wondering if that is a good idea. I know you can pray the Rosary and achieve participation as you stated, so would praying the old Latin Mass quietly to myself at a new Mass be the same as praying a Rosary quietly to myself (uniting intentions to the Mass at hand etc.)?

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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:47 pm 
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Paladin
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PDUBYA wrote:
I really don't know what to do, the more and more I study about the liturgy, the more I pray about it, I'm more and more having an aversion to the New Mass. I'm almost ready to give up on it and throw in the towel.


Give up how?
If its the only Mass in the area you can attend you must attend.
I would recommend what PED suggested (or maybe what I do, if anyone smarter than me here could tell me if its a good idea or not).

You could look into Eastern Catholic rite Masses if they're in the area (Byzantine for example), but I am not sure if its a better idea to stick to your own rite. Why? I don't know. Maybe someone else here could explain one way or the other.

Or you can spend your Sundays road-tripping to the nearest TLM.

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"The proof of love is to suffer for the one you love." -St. Pio
"Start by doing what's necessary; then do what's possible; and suddenly you are doing the impossible." -St. Francis of Assisi
"We need neither progressives nor reactionary conservatives, only Catholic Traditionalists" - Ryan Grant


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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:10 am 
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Why not come to Rome? You will hear the Holy Father say the Novus Ordo Mass in Latin. :fyi:

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 Post subject: Re: Novus Ordo
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:27 pm 
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Paladin
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lbt wrote:
Why not come to Rome? You will hear the Holy Father say the Novus Ordo Mass in Latin. :fyi:


There's more to it than Latin I'm afraid.

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"The proof of love is to suffer for the one you love." -St. Pio
"Start by doing what's necessary; then do what's possible; and suddenly you are doing the impossible." -St. Francis of Assisi
"We need neither progressives nor reactionary conservatives, only Catholic Traditionalists" - Ryan Grant


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