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 Post subject: Are curses real?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 9:41 pm 
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Master
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Are curses still real? What does the Church have to say about this? I know you hear of them in the Scriptures but as a protestant I remember specifically blanketing my comfort and hope on calvary. In otherwords, upon the death of Christ, curses seized to exist for those who believe.

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 Post subject: Re: Are curses real?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:12 pm 
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Sons of Thunder
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Dominic wrote:
Are curses still real? What does the Church have to say about this? I know you hear of them in the Scriptures but as a protestant I remember specifically blanketing my comfort and hope on calvary. In otherwords, upon the death of Christ, curses seized to exist for those who believe.

It depends on what you mean by "curse"

Cursing, as used the in the bible, and historically by the Church isn't always an evil act even. God curses people, Noah cursed Canaan, Joshua cursed whomever should build Jericho, Jesus curses the fig tree, etc.The Church has referred to excommunication as a curse. Anathema sit is often translated "let him be accursed". In scripture it is often used for God's wrath, or a threat of the same, often in prophecy

In moral theology, cursing generally means to will evil upon someone or something. This is usually sinful. But not always. Hence the curse of excommunication, which is actually ordered to the sinner's good. The evil called down upon them is meant for their correction, so that they won't be damned. Likewise, it is a curse to wish someone come into pain. While this need not be a sin (as when one wills that someone gets his comeuppance, so that he correct his life before he goes further down into sin), it most usually is.

If you mean by curses something like black magic, invoking satanic spirits, etc. Well, that gets into some questions. Certainly there are evil spirits, demons, etc. I would say then that yes curses exist, but for he who follows Christ any calamities will never be more than he can bear and never permitted except he grow further in grace. I would tend to think that most such attempts at curses are inefficacious...the aim of the demons being as much to corrupt the person invoking the curse by aiding their hatred as anything else. And they can only do what God permits.

If I can find it, I will post the passage from St. Thomas on the evil eye...seriously. He deals with the evil eye in detail

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 Post subject: Re: Are curses real?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:19 pm 
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Couldn't find the passage I was looking for, but he gives a bit of it in the Summa, prima pars, 117 art 3 ad 2

Avicenna assigns the cause of bewitchment to the fact that corporeal matter has a natural tendency to obey spiritual substance rather than natural contrary agents. Therefore when the soul is of strong imagination, it can change corporeal matter. This he says is the cause of the "evil eye."

But it has been shown above (Question 110, Article 2) that corporeal matter does not obey spiritual substances at will, but the Creator alone. Therefore it is better to say, that by a strong imagination the (corporeal) spirits of the body united to that soul are changed, which change in the spirits takes place especially in the eyes, to which the more subtle spirits can reach. And the eyes infect the air which is in contact with them to a certain distance: in the same way as a new and clear mirror contracts a tarnish from the look of a "menstruata," as Aristotle says (De Somn. et Vigil.; [De Insomniis ii).

Hence then when a soul is vehemently moved to wickedness, as occurs mostly in little old women, according to the above explanation, the countenance becomes venomous and hurtful, especially to children, who have a tender and most impressionable body. It is also possible that by God's permission, or from some hidden deed, the spiteful demons co-operate in this, as the witches may have some compact with them.


Hey, St. Thomas had been in Italy is all I have to say!

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 Post subject: Re: Are curses real?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:29 am 
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Dominic wrote:
Are curses still real? What does the Church have to say about this? I know you hear of them in the Scriptures but as a protestant I remember specifically blanketing my comfort and hope on calvary. In otherwords, upon the death of Christ, curses seized to exist for those who believe.

According to the Vatican exorcist curses are real and some can kill you. If you stay in a state of sanctifying grace they probably can't have much effect on you.

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 Post subject: Re: Are curses real?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 6:59 am 
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In the book The Rite, the priest mentions curses several times as being very real and often a doorway to possession.

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